Political discourse
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If you think the next US civil war will be fought between Nazis and Marxist-Leninists, you don’t understand American politics very well. The US in 2025 isn’t Stalingrad in 1942.
Nitpick: They’re Marxist-Leninists, not Marxism-Leninists.
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I’m open to changing my mind, but you need proof rather than just saying that I’m incorrect. I have yet to see compelling evidence that raising minimum wage makes any difference at all in the long term. A lot of studies have been made to prove that it doesn’t cause job loss but none that prove that it changes the levels of inequality or pulls people out of poverty in real economic terms.
Proof: It’s literally what the Mexican government did in 2018-2024. Lifted millions of people out of poverty even as the economy mostly remained the same and/or shrunk. See: https://apnews.com/article/poverty-mexico-president-andres-manuel-lopez-obrador-social-welfare-c7ec7f184ce8163e84fffa1b9f47aed8
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Centrism doesn’t mean sitting on a fence. It means most of the time understanding that both sides are right and wrong at the same time, I often see the problem identified correctly but the solution that is prescribed is absolutely incorrect.
Here are some centrist positions.
We need to stop unfettered immigration, so closing the borders is great, locking up and kicking out immigrants who have committed legal offenses is good, and we should expedite that process but we shouldn’t be kidnapping or profiling people. We shouldn’t be giving economic assistance to illegal immigrants. I know it doesn’t happen at the federal level but it does happen at the state level.
Banning guns won’t solve the violence problem, guns don’t kill people people kill people. American violence is caused by inequality and lack of mental healthcare. Solve that instead of taking guns away.
We should have higher taxes, universal healthcare and stronger safety nets but also much less regulation because most of it is actually designed to protect the incumbent corporations. Free the markets as much as possible, but never bail out a single corporation that fails, bail out the employees.
Increasing the minimum wage does nothing.
Instead of relying on underpaid immigrant labor the US should stop giving cash and tax subsidies to farmers and instead directly subsidize their wages by paying the employees directly. This is my middle of the road solution, we should actually consider nationalization of farms. One of the few things where that could work right now because I think nationalization in general leads to terrible mismanagement. But farms are already inefficient, corrupt and mismanaged and also living on the government tits so we might as well.
Justifying things as “scientific” when the science is social science and the results are not reproducible is intellectually dishonest, and is rampant in discourse about various topics nowadays. The academia brought upon themselves the mistrust they have garnered. This is good because universities have become job training centers and they were never meant to be that, so maybe we’re due for a little creative destruction.
I could continue, but I got shit to do.
We need to stop unfettered immigration, so closing the borders is great, locking up and kicking out immigrants who have committed legal offenses is good, and we should expedite that process but we shouldn’t be kidnapping or profiling people.
This is literally what modern fascism is made of. It always starts with “expediting the process” and “immigrants who committed legal offenses,” but these terms are so malleable that you will relatively soon end up at the kidnapping and profiling stage. And let’s not get into how so-called “unfettered immigration” (which is actually pretty fettered when you look at the process) harms exactly nobody if handled properly, as many examples (e.g. Germany) show.
but also much less regulation because most of it is actually designed to protect the incumbent corporations.
What kind of regulation do you want gone?
Justifying things as “scientific” when the science is social science and the results are not reproducible is intellectually dishonest, and is rampant in discourse about various topics nowadays.
Social science is science and underpins many aspects of modern society such as urban design. Do you have an example of this in action?
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And this is what I mean. Everything is very much not politics but if you politicize everything then by definition it becomes so. People need to stop doing that.
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And this is what I mean. Everything is very much not politics but if you politicize everything then by definition it becomes so. People need to stop doing that.
What’s an example of something that’s not politics but is politicized?
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You’ve already asserted that there are no valid answers to that question. Why did you bother asking?
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Centrism doesn’t mean sitting on a fence. It means most of the time understanding that both sides are right and wrong at the same time, I often see the problem identified correctly but the solution that is prescribed is absolutely incorrect.
Here are some centrist positions.
We need to stop unfettered immigration, so closing the borders is great, locking up and kicking out immigrants who have committed legal offenses is good, and we should expedite that process but we shouldn’t be kidnapping or profiling people. We shouldn’t be giving economic assistance to illegal immigrants. I know it doesn’t happen at the federal level but it does happen at the state level.
Banning guns won’t solve the violence problem, guns don’t kill people people kill people. American violence is caused by inequality and lack of mental healthcare. Solve that instead of taking guns away.
We should have higher taxes, universal healthcare and stronger safety nets but also much less regulation because most of it is actually designed to protect the incumbent corporations. Free the markets as much as possible, but never bail out a single corporation that fails, bail out the employees.
Increasing the minimum wage does nothing.
Instead of relying on underpaid immigrant labor the US should stop giving cash and tax subsidies to farmers and instead directly subsidize their wages by paying the employees directly. This is my middle of the road solution, we should actually consider nationalization of farms. One of the few things where that could work right now because I think nationalization in general leads to terrible mismanagement. But farms are already inefficient, corrupt and mismanaged and also living on the government tits so we might as well.
Justifying things as “scientific” when the science is social science and the results are not reproducible is intellectually dishonest, and is rampant in discourse about various topics nowadays. The academia brought upon themselves the mistrust they have garnered. This is good because universities have become job training centers and they were never meant to be that, so maybe we’re due for a little creative destruction.
I could continue, but I got shit to do.
So you’re leaving the US, considering you’re an illegal immigrant here right? I mean, unless you’re indigenous it seems pretty illegal for you to claim any right to live here and boot others out. See the issue with saying people are illegal?
“Living on the governments tit” is straight up right-winger bullshit. We pay taxes, why the fuck should the government hoard that money and use it on shit that doesn’t benefit the people? That is the ENTIRE FUCKING POINT of a government, to pool resources and skills to better society as a whole.
You think science is bullshit and that higher education should be “creatively” destroyed. How you think that isn’t fascism is some serious mental gymnastics.
You could continue, but you know your viewpoint is hard right and you’re too cowardly to stick around and defend your bullshit because your fragile fee-fees will be hurt.
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You’ve already asserted that there are no valid answers to that question. Why did you bother asking?
Because either you’ll cite a good example and prove me wrong, or you’ll cite a bad example and confirm I’m right. While I doubt you’ll be convinced in the latter case, someone reading this exchange might be, so there’s value to be had in either case.
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You’ve already asserted that everything is politics whether I like it or not, including this conversation, and since I don’t get involved in “prove me wrong” political conversations on the internet I’ll just exit.
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This is bullshit
Trying to pretend that there’s a concerted far-left effort to create civil war in 'Murica is patently absurd
Sure, there may be a handful of nutters, but they pale in comparison to the number of far-right who are actively lusting for the blood of the people they hate and fear
Wasn’t there a movement to have the western states cecede after the last 2 Trump wins?
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So you’re leaving the US, considering you’re an illegal immigrant here right? I mean, unless you’re indigenous it seems pretty illegal for you to claim any right to live here and boot others out. See the issue with saying people are illegal?
“Living on the governments tit” is straight up right-winger bullshit. We pay taxes, why the fuck should the government hoard that money and use it on shit that doesn’t benefit the people? That is the ENTIRE FUCKING POINT of a government, to pool resources and skills to better society as a whole.
You think science is bullshit and that higher education should be “creatively” destroyed. How you think that isn’t fascism is some serious mental gymnastics.
You could continue, but you know your viewpoint is hard right and you’re too cowardly to stick around and defend your bullshit because your fragile fee-fees will be hurt.
“Living on the governments tit” is straight up right-winger bullshit. We pay taxes, why the fuck should the government hoard that money and use it on shit that doesn’t benefit the people? That is the ENTIRE FUCKING POINT of a government, to pool resources and skills to better society as a whole.
True on your other points, but here they’re saying the money should be given to employees rather than employers. That’s not rightwing at all; it’s leftwing if anything. I mean it’s the farming version of being anti-corporate welfare.
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Sure, that had a semblance of socialism and rational thought to it, but the fact that they spin it as a negative and imply that the government shouldn’t be funding social welfare is pretty clear in showing that they’re too ignorant to actually understand what socialism is.
Ironic, considering that right-wingers more than any other group rely on sucking the governments tit to survive day to day
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Exactly. I think government and corporations exist to generate wealth to benefit society. Right now it exists to benefit corporations.
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So you’re leaving the US, considering you’re an illegal immigrant here right? I mean, unless you’re indigenous it seems pretty illegal for you to claim any right to live here and boot others out. See the issue with saying people are illegal?
“Living on the governments tit” is straight up right-winger bullshit. We pay taxes, why the fuck should the government hoard that money and use it on shit that doesn’t benefit the people? That is the ENTIRE FUCKING POINT of a government, to pool resources and skills to better society as a whole.
You think science is bullshit and that higher education should be “creatively” destroyed. How you think that isn’t fascism is some serious mental gymnastics.
You could continue, but you know your viewpoint is hard right and you’re too cowardly to stick around and defend your bullshit because your fragile fee-fees will be hurt.
Free open borders doesn’t work unless everyone, literally everyone is working on the same legal framework . This could be good long term project for humanity but as it stands right now now, national divisions matter. You can’t have people that weren’t born here overwhelming our nation and getting aid when our own people are suffering economic hardship. The problem with people like you is that you want everything now, and that’s not possible except through extreme violence and often ends up not solving the problems. I would love to be able to remake the system from the top down, but we know that never ends right.
I don’t think science is bullshit, I think non reroducible experiments are not science. I love science, but the social sciences in the present exist in the same stage of development as medicine was in the Middle Ages. This is a provable fact. Universities need to be centers of knowledge again and not job training centers.
Like someone pointed out, I said corporations are living off the government tit, that’s a fact. I would prefer if the tit was feeding us instead. I think I made it very clear that I’m pro social safety nets.
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Fascism has an established definition. Hell there’s a literal manifesto
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Can I be a leftist without being a tankie then?
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Six strawmen in a single post! Well done, that must be some kind of record!
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It’s not a bell curve. It’s a trumpet headed to the right.
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Sure, that had a semblance of socialism and rational thought to it, but the fact that they spin it as a negative and imply that the government shouldn’t be funding social welfare is pretty clear in showing that they’re too ignorant to actually understand what socialism is.
Ironic, considering that right-wingers more than any other group rely on sucking the governments tit to survive day to day
First, they’re not claiming to be socialist. Second, they’re criticizing corporate welfare, not social welfare. They support social welfare in the exact same comment. Rich pricks sucking on the government’s tit and providing nothing to society is a bad thing, or at least the leftwing position considers it to be a bad thing. Are you even reading what they wrote?
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Six strawmen in a single post! Well done, that must be some kind of record!
It is clever, you see, that any disagreement must be done online, therefore reinforcing the premise of the meme.
