Based and Red Pilled Gigachad, many such cases 😔

Michael

I want to thank you for sourcing your claims and engaging with me in good faith.

Please see American Kompromat by Unger and Active Measures documentary linked elsewhere itt.

I will give it a watch and the former a read at a later time when I get over my illness, but the rise of Trump surely didn’t have anything to do with the DNC and Clinton campaign pushing Trump as a pied piper candidate and telling the media to take him seriously. Russia did not make the mainstream media mention him an uncountable number of times. Russia also does not fund domestic right-wing organizations that back Trump to the best of my knowledge.

From the verified, leaked DNC memo sent by the Clinton campaign in 2015:

Our hope is that the goal of a potential HRC campaign and the DNC would be one-‐in-‐the-‐same: to make whomever the Republicans nominate unpalatable to a majority of the electorate. We have outlined three strategies to obtain our goal:

Force all Republican candidates to lock themselves into extreme conservative positions that will hurt them in a
general election;

In this scenario, we don’t want to marginalize the more extreme candidates, but make them more “Pied Piper” candidates who actually represent the mainstream of the Republican Party. Pied Piper candidates include, but aren’t limited to:
• Ted Cruz
• Donald Trump
• Ben Carson

We need to be elevating the Pied Piper candidates so that they are leaders of the pack and tell the press to them
seriously.

It’s clear that the press took him seriously.

Regarding illicit content/ snuff, here’s a much smaller example with monkey torture rings: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-65951188

I’m not sure if that’s relevant to the discussion.

Torture by Putin’s admin in prisons: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-62465043

I don’t disbelieve that.

Cyberwarfare by Russia, including propaganda: https://www.geopoliticalmonitor.com/exploring-cyber-darkness-how-moscow-undermines-the-west-via-the-dark-web/

Not entirely relevant to the discussion, but a lot of these vectors could be mitigated through sane practices like not exposing our e.g. energy infrastructure to the open web.

https://www.politico.com/news/2024/09/01/us-election-software-national-security-threats-00176615

Long read, got through most of it. States and our country being broadly incompetent with our voting systems is well-known. We can do better at any point to standardize systems, increase oversight and transparency, improve efficiency, and vastly improve security. Experts and other influential figures have been sounding the alarm for a long time.

[sources of election interference in Europe]

I don’t live in these countries and I did not experience these happenings, but I will say that it is incredibly more plausible to me that Russia is more overtly influencing European politics, and I don’t need a wealth of evidence to hold that position. Thanks for the links though, I will check them out on my own time.

Crypto funds rightwing extremists, usually in preparation for an election takeover: https://www.defenseone.com/threats/2025/01/report-crypto-donations-right-wing-extremist-groups-rising-especially-europe/402427/

Unregulated, speculative, and essentially untraceable currencies should not have ever been able to be converted to other currencies and exist in the form that they have. I am unsurprised, but at the same time I believe that we can do better.

[various sources relating to the Ukraine sovereignty war/Russian invasion]

I am a believer in sovereignty and I support the people of Ukraine. I’ll leave it at that.

[various sources relating to Musk & Starlink]

Yes, Musk is very likely a traitor and is not a good faith actor. The facts are in evidence, yet you are the first person I have seen consolidating this information.

Lol you sweet summer child. There’s a world war coming, the entire EU has been unable to stop this.

The EU has done nothing concrete on multiple fronts. The Biden administration also largely abandoned Ukraine…

I don’t see a world war or a civil war coming, call me naive but I feel there is little appetite from populaces across the world. I don’t believe China would seriously position themselves with Russia against the world, despite recent developments which I am aware of. Again, maybe I’m naive, but I’ll hold my position.

Yes, had we had a national online forum, this could’ve been prevented.

I disagree, I am a firm believer in decentralized social media. I dislike Lemmy and other fediverse platforms for a few key reasons that we may agree on, but they are the best we have currently. Specific countries could regulate or tailor domestic decentralized media to fit their needs. Centralized, mostly unregulated, and advertiser-driven media has got us into the mess we are in.

Tucker Carlson Funded by Russian Propaganda Machine, Justin Trudeau Testifies Under Oath

I don’t see Justin Trudeau or Tucker Carlson as good faith actors. I need evidence.

We are under active attack and warfare. Would you say this about Ukrainians or Gazans? This is victim blaming. This warfare is brand new, it’s like blaming Europe for not being able to defend themselves against Genghis Khan because he developed horseback warfare.

This is how democracy and representative governance works - it’s not victim-blaming.

Eta: Please stop editing your parent comment as a response to me, and just reply below so we can have a normal back and forth. You’ve had more than enough time while I got these links to finish the above comment.

You are editing your comment, as well as your initial response to me, just as much as I am now trying to respond to you. My initial response to you was only mildly edited after I saw your edits. Chill, I want to make myself perfectly clear.

Further, you’ve just been given substantial links that Russia is funding and orchestrating a global Nazi fascist movement for possibly billions of dollars and killing millions for a global war, which makes them Nazis that are allied with China, India, etc.

Our right-wing think tanks and gems like Musk do plenty to influence European politics, as well.

To me, it seems that you are vastly overestimating BRICS. World war does not end well for anyone. It’s naive to suggest otherwise. I really hope you can calm yourself down, regardless of the evidence presented. War is never an inevitability or a certainty.

surph_ninja@lemmy.world

And what actions are those? Like partnering with the west to install a far-right regime?

hark@lemmy.world

Do you? Control over the medium is far more powerful than being a mere user of that medium.

LustyArgonian

Article 4 of NATO was recently activated. Russia sent drones into Romania and Poland. Germany is uping their defenses. Biden admin didn’t abandon Ukraine, Trump made a point to call Biden a warmonger over it even.

If China didn’t want Russia to be in wars, they wouldn’t send over North Korean soldiers to Russia (NK is basically a satellite slave state of China). The world war already happened when they got involved. They just don’t want to escalate it until their war manufacturing and supplies are figured out.

China wants Taiwan and the South China Sea and probably Australia for the gold. Each BRICS member has major territories goals they want, eg India and the Indus River which also has gold. BRICS was explicitly made to destabilize USD and the Euro.

I am not saying to ban other social media, I am saying as a cornerstone of democracy, we need to be able to have forums with our government in official and secure ways, that we can track, and sue over free speech violations. We cannot do that with private companies including private servers. You can just get banned and silenced. Further, we should have streamlined ways of getting government notices, recalls, and contacting our officials. No upvotes or ads allowed.

I need evidence

Active Measures doc explicitly goes over Tucker Carlson and Trump and others. Please see that doc. That’s why you’re missing so much info. I’ve given it to you already. Also the book American Kompromat.

This is how democracy and representative governance works - it’s not victim-blaming.

Wow, really? I had no clue, because we’ve been living under active attacks to our governance and democracy specifically so we CAN’T do exactly that, so we DON’T have power, because it is a fascist takeover, including blackmailing numerous government officials and public figures. Fascists don’t respect democracy. And it is victim blaming, which supports abusers - in this case, supports Nazis and fascists. Nice.

You are editing your comment just as much as I am now trying to respond to you. Chill.

No, you don’t manage my feelings, and further, your edits messed with my other comment and made it reset. So I think I get to be annoyed that it cost me an extra 15min of my life trying to tell you stuff that you couldve googled yourself because you’re so geopolitically ignorant.

Oh and btw, if you need more evidence - go look it up. I am not in charge of your education and am just giving one basic link to support my points. If you want detailed info, be proactive and seek it out and learn. As it is, you come across as willfully and deliberately ignorant and needing to be spoonfed basic information the rest of us have known since 2016.

Michael

[…] first block of your comment […]

I -already- said I am acutely aware of recent developments. We disagree. Russia is not capable, India is unstable, and China is likely to let Russia fail as they essentially already have been. World war is absolute suicide for the human race.

I am not saying to ban other social media, I am saying as a cornerstone of democracy, we need to be able to have forums with our government in official and secure ways, that we can track, and sue over free speech violations. We cannot do that with private companies including private servers. You can just get banned and silenced. Further, we should have streamlined ways of getting government notices, recalls, and contacting our officials. No upvotes or ads allowed.

If I trusted my government, I’d be more inclined to agree with you. I’ve been lied to and gaslit far too much. My government didn’t represent my interests or the interests of the American people even under Obama. Centralized power structures are literally the problem causing every single thing we are talking about, for the most part.

so we DON’T have power

Wouldn’t it be possible to organize a vote of no confidence outside of our election system to depose our government?

No, you don’t manage my feelings, and further, your edits messed with my other comment and made it reset. So I think I get to be annoyed that it cost me an extra 15min of my life trying to tell you stuff that you couldve googled yourself because you’re so geopolitically ignorant.

You edited your initial response to me after posting. I caught your comment before you finished.

Linking me documentaries and books instead of direct, primary sources does not respect my time.

LustyArgonian

They are not America even if they seized fascist control of America. America is the people here and that includes activists and trans people. That includes you and me.

That we cry out and care is evidence the universe cries out and cares, since we are part of the universe as well. The universe through us cries out.

That we cry out and care is evidence Americans care, because we are both Americans. It is so so so important to not equate America with hate, but instead to equate the MAGA admin with hate.

And regardless, those anti-trans laws are literally Putin/Russian as a policy - remember how Russia got mad at the Olympic boxer and demanded she be tested? Russia literally funded the politicians for those laws, made all the propaganda pieces and ads, etc etc etc. And ofc some traitors and assholes went with it.

LustyArgonian

Russia has been capable for a decade now and again, has been propped up by China including the use of NK.

Suicide for the human race? Duh. And that’s climate change. They want to reduce the carrying capacity of the earth because they cannot figure out other ways. Already huge catastrophic floods in China. Farming and food will take a hit soon.

Then don’t use it. Just like we have a post office, and UPS. But you need communications to be centralized somewhat lol, that’s how communcation works. You also wouldn’t say anything on there you wouldn’t say in a Town Hall, it would be your official profile. The power structure also wouldn’t be as centralized as regular social media- that’s why you can sue and demand things, based on constitution and bill of rights and other laws. That means you actually have power over it.

There’s no legal way for us to depose the government or even to suggest to depose the government. I would never organize to depose the government. I would never trust someone on social suggesting such a thing either. I have other plans for addressing this, and they are nunya.

Linking me documentaries instead of primary sources does not respect my time.

I never removed that. Repsect your time? How about respect your blatant ignorance? Complicated topics cannot be summarized in a Tweet or Lemmy post, they take time like books, long form media, or yes, documentaries and news interviews, gasp. Not everything is so simple, sorry kiddo. And the documentary interviews primary sources like Hillary Clinton and John McCain. The documentary IS a primary source. You’d know that if you’d just watch it. It’s free on Youtube and has been linked. How intellectually pathetic of you, as I suspected you’d be.

nasan@sopuli.xyz

I’ve told co-workers that a person’s resilience against propaganda is a spectrum. No one is completely immune, but you can approach high levels of resilience at the cost of your sanity.

trickdacy@lemmy.world

…yes. you have access to search engines

nasan@sopuli.xyz

This is an extension of the adage that the best lies contain elements of the truth.

dasus@lemmy.world

but I wouldn’t even put Russia in the top 5 sources of it.

;>

dasus@lemmy.world

And what actions are those? Like partnering with the west to install a far-right regime?

Why would you partner with someone if you have direct access yourself?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_invasion

Michael

Russia has been capable for a decade now and again, has been propped up by China including the use of NK.

Disagree. I believe Russia will see a coup or revolution before a proper war. They have utterly failed against Ukraine, it’s unbelievable to me how much they have failed. I have been observing the invasion, now and again, since day 1 - and the buildup prior to that.

Suicide for the human race? Duh. And that’s climate change.

See my instance. I’m aware. It is my opinion and belief that the oligarchy here in America wants the whole world to perish while they wait it out in their self-sufficient bunkers.

Then don’t use it. Just like we have a post office, and UPS. But you need communications to be centralized somewhat lol, that’s how communcation works. You also wouldn’t say anything on there you wouldn’t say in a Town Hall, it would be your official profile. The power structure also wouldn’t be as centralized as regular social media- that’s why you can sue and demand things, based on constitution and bill of rights and other laws. That means you actually have ppwer over it.

I argue for decentralized, loosely standardized, democratic, socialist structures. The legal system is absolutely and completely busted. I really shouldn’t need to get into that. Hopefully you can agree that the Supreme Court is beyond saving. Your idea is a fantasy, but it’s a nice one if there was any state that truly represented its populace. I do value it though, and even if I call it a fantasy, I like it in theory.

There’s no legal way for us to depose the government or even to suggest to depose the government. I would never organize to depose the government.

Guess we just let Trump destroy the government and install a complete dictatorship in earnest…

I disagree, we do have power.

Complicated topics cannot be summarized in a Tweet or Lemmy post, they take time like books, long form media, or yes, documentaries and news interviews, gasp.

If people in debates are told to source their claims, there is a preference towards direct evidence, primary sources, and specific excerpts. I prefer direct evidence, specific excerpts, and related argumentation. If a primary source does not provide direct evidence openly, I’m not hunting for it at the drop of a hat or trusting it at face value unless it is convincing. This shouldn’t be difficult.

Regardless, I will expose myself to the documentary and book with an open mind when I have literal -hours- or -days- to digest it all, and you are absolutely free to disagree with my opinions and personal beliefs. I accept being called naive because I care about the human race and I want it broadly return to sanity - the consequences of a world war are absolutely unimaginable. Forecasting war doesn’t help anything, unless you are in the military preparing to respond if it does happen.

deathbybigsad@sh.itjust.works

Yea naw, my parents watch WeChat short videos and read their BS articles and they constantly regurgitate anti-Democrat rhetorics, and whenever someone gets shot by police, they fucking cheer, the homeless people, anyone with a “mental illness”, even George Floyd, they think trials are waste of time and resources, they want the system to just skip the trial and want the suspects dead.

~~Can’t even blame “Americans” for this, the CCP has full control of the content, they clearly aren’t censoring it.~~

WeChat is literally poisoning the Chinese Overseas Diaspora. Its another tentacle of the CCP’s power. There’s no doubt they also infect social media platforms like facebook, xitter, etc…They sow chaos, and untimately, whatever the CCP does damages the repututation of anyone who is ethnic Chinese or looks ethnic Chinese. They are infaming Sinophobia by being the worse representatives of my people. And all the abuse that I have endured from my parents is from this toxic culture, fuck this “filial piety” BS, fuck conservatism. I’ve been helping out in my parents bussiness, and they still say I’m useless. I really wanna go back in time and shoot confucious for inventing the stupid ass religion, fuck your 孝順, its literally parental indoctrination to control their children. Evil ass shit. Fuck confucious.

Nvm

dasus@lemmy.world

I agree with a lot of that but honestly, what is the Russian capability currently to open up a new front anywhere if we are not talking nuclear war?

Sure they’re prepared to waste a lot. But can they waste that much without getting into so severe issues that even their propaganda won’t push through? Oh right, I forget, propaganda is basically for foreign states and domestically you can just use threats of violence and arrests.

Also “carrying capacity” is a poor way to talk about bad infrastructure.

The world isn’t full. It’s built wrong.

LustyArgonian

People make fun of the Civilization games, but in them, you can win more than one way. War doesn’t have to be fought with nukes (or even bombs - eg economically, culturally) and largely hasn’t been, especially recently.

Russia is being propped up by China and India et al. Imo when the west is more weakened, China will make their moves for Taiwan and the South China Sea. But maybe not, or maybe in a way we don’t expect (eg diplomatically) because China REALLY wants to be seen as like, the main guys who are super reasonable and modern etc. Recommend the PBS documentary Made in Ethiopia to see a little of China’s foreign policy in action. They want clean hands, I think. But they want those territories too.

Russia uses extensive propaganda domestically.

I say carrying capacity because that’s how they view it in light of climate change and all the other issues we face:
https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciadv.adh2458

We are actually now past 7 of 9 planetary boundaries to support human life. Reducing the carrying capacity (aka total human population) of the earth won’t help, we need everyone to work together to solve these issues. Imo a sun shield in space to deflect some UV would buy us time to sequester carbon and create sustainable living solutions. I think if the rich kill everyone, they will also die. I do not think they have the intellect or wisdom to solve this without the people of the world.

Michael

I think if the rich kill everyone, they will also die.

They have been preparing for decades, at least. You are free to believe what you want though.

They want the Fallout games to become reality. It’s almost certain. Fuck all of that. Pushing the development of AI unsustainably in a way that other countries can mirror (e.g. China) is suicide for the country, besides them, and solidifies my belief.

LustyArgonian

A major goal of nearly every Russian war is to kill off their own young men (in this war, esp indigenous people living near Mongolia are being sent to war to die). A lot of wars are like that - two leaders with populations that are getting agitated, send them to fight each other and take all their stuff and their women. Classic attack by the top to the bottom and gaslight them that it was for a good cause the whole time. Maybe Russia could have a coup or revolution, but maybe not. Hasn’t happened to Putin yet but we can dream.

oligarchy here in America wants the whole world to perish while they wait it out in their self-sufficient bunkers.

I think it’s the global wealthy, but same. The Titanic sub was a preview of the wealthy’s hubris when it comes to science.

I think our legal system as its bare bones isn’t bad. The way arguments are presented etc. It was formed via Greek philosophy, at the same time as ideas like democracy lol. They are intrinsically related and good faith arguments and logic are the cornerstone of progress and society and fact. There’s so many amazing, empowering, and incredible things about our legal system. A huge part of the fight for civil rights was literally fought in the courtroom. Please study the civil rights era to understand progressive movements with courts.

But there’s many many things that can be done to reform the issues in it incl the Supreme Court. I figure you would like it, because it is decentralized and one of the only ways an average citizen can get any kind of power in this country over their government. Pretty rad.

Yeah again my plans are not your business and not something I discuss online. Youre giving off Fed energy over there.

I can tell you’ve never been homeless or did anything with the homeless network. Ever hear of Slab City? The government is effective as a slave machine and will grind you up in it no problem. I am an abolitionist first, and imo the most important thing is to stay free as much as possible and to hold onto the power you have as much as possible. Being thoughtful during fascist takeover is wise. Take battles wisely.

The documentary is direct evidence, primary sources, and specific excerpts. Literally there’s even pictures. It’s so solid as evidence and as a case, they didn’t even get sued by Trump over it (avoiding discovery). Length does not determine validity. And it’s so weird of you to push back on it as a source just because you’re too big of a baby to learn what everyone else has been talking about for years - it came out in 2018.

If you want to do this democratically - then go to the protests and town halls and talk to people. Go ahead. I’m not stopping you, there are many movements like that already.

catsarebadpeople

So 80% of lemmy.ml users?

LustyArgonian

It doesn’t matter how long they’ve prepared. What’s coming will destroy ecologies in huge ways, possibly collapsing all megafauna and even things like insects which have already experienced significant population collapses. People need vitamins and micronutrients to live, requires a varied diet.

We barely grow plants in space. Biosphere thing barely worked and needed outside intervention. We NEED earth. I say this as a person very educated in science- we NEED the planet intact.

The Titanic sub was a preview of the hubris of the wealthy against science. They are genuinely so narcissistic they think they can conquer extreme natural phenomena.

They particularly like AI because they believe it’s the perfect slave (and we are not because we can dissent). So yeah they will kill the world for it. And for oil, and for gold, and for money, and manufacturing, because capitalism requires capital be made and sought even if ot isnt efficient and people die. Capital above all else.